Barry Horowitz on Bret Har Saying He Should be in the WWE Hall of Fame, If There was Antisemitism in his 1995 Push, more

Show: Wrestling Epicenter
Guest: Barry Horowitz
Date: 11/01/2024
Your Host: James Walsh

In 2011, I was asked by a friend of a friend if I’d like to interview Barry Horowitz. My reaction was, “Um, do I even have to answer that question? Of course I do!” Like most of you, I was raised on the WWE and saw Barry in countless matches. I also saw him become “The Winner” in the Global Wrestling Federation and even capture the GWF Light Heavyweight Title from Jerry Lynn. Aside from having trading cards of him from the late 1980’s and always knowing he was a far better wrestler than his win-loss record might indicate, I could also tell behind the man who patted himself on the back before every match was a good guy and a cool story. Well, our 2011 interview got a little tip of the iceberg of his story. The whole iceberg? Well, you can read all about his story in his new book “Wrestling is my Gimmick!”

Well, it has been 13 years so we imposed upon “Mr. Technical”, “The Winner” himself to discuss his new book for a new interview. We cover some career highlights. But, also discuss this great new book and where to get it.  

Where do you get it?  Order your copy of the book here! Or, go to Amazon and type in barry Horowitz book. Or, just go to the publisher’s site! https://mcfarlandbooks.com/product/wrestling-is-my-gimmick/?srsltid=AfmBOopsM9liLoKjO_kPRSdGhTshYBerviFRTIAxiNStCjyrZkvMT38j

Please check out www.WrestlingEpicenter.com for more interviews like this. If you use this on your sites, please link back to ours. That is all we ask!

BARRY HOROWITZ: 

On finally writing his book:
“You know, it is exciting. You are the first person to really interview me about the book. This is a project I’ve been thinking about for about 5 years now. But, I never really put my foot on the accelerator because other things were ahead of it. I knew that I could get to it… It wasn’t on the priorities list. But, then, I started to investigate. Then, I was at a huge meet and greet in Virginia Beach and I was approached by Jason Norman. I was impressed with his professionalism. He presented me with a business card, told me his idea, and I knew he was the right guy to do this with.”

On the book writing process:
“I am going to say it took a year if not better. It consisted of doing constant interviews several times a week. Sometimes they would be 10 minute conversations and sometimes they’d go up to a half hour. I always wanted to do a book. But, I never wanted it to be just another, “Oh, a wrestler’s got a book.” I wanted to make it a book about my whole journey, my whole life, my whole everything! Where it started, where I am now, and compliment the people who helped me through my journey. I wanted to praise the people who helped me learn what to do and what not to do. I don’t care if these people only did one thing for me, they made my list!”

On avoiding negativity in his book:
“As far as people who were cruel or did bad things to me, I’m not going to even put them over. I won’t! They’re useless and worthless. I don’t have time for people like that.”

On deciding what stories fit the book:
“It is tricky with a book. For example, I’m going to mention Rufus R Jones and Jimmy Valint who I used to ride with in my first territory and my first full-time job. I was workig part-time and here and there for Vince McMahon Sr and here and there in Florida. I was averaging 5 nights a week working. These guys helped me. Now, I don’t mean anything by this. But, lets just say you’re number 2 on the pecking order and Hulk Hogan is number 8. I don’t need to pretend I was best friends with certain people just because I was in the same locker room. I don’t need to do that. I don’t need to name drop to impress my fans. So, I do talk about people like Johnny Weaver or Jay and Mark Youngblood. They helped me. So, the focus is on the people who did help me. As for the guys who didn’t help me, I don’t put them over! They did me wrong. I don’t care for them. So, why put them over by talking about them?”

On if he agrees with Dustin Rhodes not liking the term “jobber”:
“It is interesting to see the pecking order. Ok, so Dustin Rhodes said it. Lets just say Chad Gable or Kurt Angle said it. I’ve said it numerous times. That is where the silliness comes in. It is all politics. Hollywood, sports like basketball, football… They all have them. Anyway, I didn’t know that Dustin Rhodes said that. Good for him! I’ve never liked the word “jobber.” It is wrestling jargon. Marks say it because they think it sounds cool. The right term is “enhancement talent” or, as Tim hroner would say, “We’re star makers!” Now, why do I hate that term. Enhancement is myself. I could go on Monday Night RAW and work with Kevin Nash for 2 minutes and get him over. As good as Kevin is, and as savvy as he is, if I didn’t know how to work, I could ruin his match that night. It takes a village to have a really good match. Now, if I wrestle Nash on Monday night and on Tuesday, we tape Superstars and I have a match with Bret Hart, Owen Hart, Brad Armstrong, or Tommy “Wildfire” Rich, or any other technically sound wrestler, we’re going to go out there and we’re going to have an A+ match! I’m going to put them over! But, the people in the seats are going to say, “Man, that was a Hell of a match. Horowitz may have lost. But, he almost won!” It is competitive. It is just like you would see in UFC, boxing, or any sport. So, what is a jobber? He’s not in shape, his ring attire is so-so, when they introduce him he’s got the “job face” which means he doesn’t want to be there. He’s there because he has a full time job and he can go to the watercooler and tell people that he put over Tom Zenk or Brian Pillman and impress people. Now, what could he do? He’s probably half-ass trained. He probably can bump around like a jumping bean. That’s it. And, that’s why he won’t go further in his career. He doesn’t have the passion. That is my definition of “jobber.” So, if any of the so-called superstars look down on me or call me that stupid word, they’re a mark for themselves! They should be ashamed of themselves! It is disrespectful! I’ve got more ring time than they’ve had lifetime!”

On if the enhancement talent were ever told not to outshine the "superstars":
"Actually, not really. If I was there and I was on 2nd and the guys who were on 5th were worriedabout me, maybe we should change positions on the card. Maybe you should learn to wrestle better! Not everybody! There were only a couple of guys. But, I do remember that at my first TV taping for the WWWF in Allentown, PA... I mean, anybody and everybody was in that back room. I could go on and on! Mr. Fuji, Mr. Saito, Bob Backlund, Bob Orton Jr, Blackjack Mulligan, Johnny Rodz, Jose Estrada, Jimmy Snuka... And, a bunch of other guys. I don't mean to leave anybody out. But, Gorilla Monsoon walks up to us. He stands in front of me, Jeff Craney, and Bob Bradley, What Gorilla said was, "We don't need any superstars. We've got 'em!" What that meant was, "You let them do their crap. And, that's that." Now, if I did too much, these guys told me. And, these guys would be guys like Bob Backlund, Don Muraco... People who really cared about me. They saw me, this kid who was 21, he may go somewhere. I was helped by the Grand Wizard, Freddie Blassie, Captain Lou Albano. And, if it wasn't Vince McMahon Sr., it was somebody close to him who called and had me sent to Crockett. Because, I was supposed to go to Portland as set up by Jimmy Snuka. But, I'm almost glad I ended up in Crockett because I learned a lot. A lot of wrestling, a lot about people, different people there. George Scott, Gene Anderson.... Anyway, I'm glad I went there. And, I stayed there for 2 years!"

On Bret Hart saying Barry belongs in the WWE Hall of Fame:
"Yes, I have heard that. In fact, about 500 people have approached me at signings and asked me if I have heard that. I even included that quote in my book. It means a lot to get that kind of praise from a guy like Bret Hart."

On if he does want to be in the WWE Hall of Fame:
"You know, a former wrestler, I won't name names, used to like saying "Where is the WWE Hall of Fake located? It is in Vince McMahon's head." I don't give much thought ot the Hall of Fame. I have thought, though, that maybe they could open an "Enhancement Talent" wing of the Hall of Fame and honor some of the guys that made the other guys look good. I would be happy to be part of that. But, I haven't given it much real consideration."

On his run in the GWF and getting to win and even be Light Heavyweight Champion:
"That was one of my favorite runs. Eddie Gilbert did a lot for me. It was a special place, that building (The Sportatorium). I really enjoyed that environment. The travel, the hotel, the plethora of good wrestlers there. My only regret is that I wasn't there longer."

On why he left Global:
"You know, that is a good question. It was April of 1992... I can't remember if there was a conversation or an incident. Was I not booked? Was I getting busy in the WWF? I don't remember. It must not have been ahything too sinister or I would remember."

On getting a singles push in WWE in 1995:
"I didn't let it get to my head but I felt perseverance paid off. Do you know how many times I could have left there? Some people use it as a catchphrase, I live this as a shoot. "Never Give Up." I never gave up and it paid off."

On if his persona ever approached antisemitism:
"No, I never felt that way. I liked the song they chose for me. And, you have to remember, there were a lot of Jewish people in that office starting with Howard Finkel. And, in fact, and this is a little bit of backstage information for you. When they were designing my tights, they were putting stars all over it - The Star of David. The late great Chief Jay Strongbow stood up and said, "This is his religion and his nationality. It isn't like he's doing a hippie gimmick and you need a shit ton of peace signs.Put one star on them." And, he made them re-do the tights. And, he was right for doing it. It would be like if someone was coming out as a true blue Catholic and they had crosses all over the place. You don't do that!"

On if WCW was run as well as WWF in the late 1990's:
"Show wise, it was OK. Structure wise, it was out of control."

On if he's interested in coaching:
"I would love to be a coach backstage at one of these billion dollar promotions. And, if not them, one of the million dollar promotions! I do feel I would add another vegetable to the stew. Yeah, I would love to do that. I see guys back there who couldn't lace my boots... Who never worked there. Who never really made it. Maybe it is who they know, what click they're in, and... Well, I don't know. I'm not trying to put myself over. But, I'd say I check the box for everything."

On if he regrets never working with Hulk Hogan:
"No, not at all. It would have been nice. But, I really don't regret never having that opportunity. I got to work with a lot of good guys. And, Hulk is a good guy also. But, I really don't regret never having wrestled him."

On Hulk Hogan's national stardom of late with Donald Trump:
"I won't get into the politics of it. But, it doesn't surprise me at all. Hulk is a star. I'm happy for him!"